“Venerable sir, the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta does not describe what is unintended as greatly reprehensible.”
“But if one intends it, householder?”
“Then it is greatly reprehensible, venerable sir.”
“But under which [of the three rods] does the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta describe volition, householder?”
“Under the mental rod, venerable sir.”586
“Householder, householder, pay attention how you reply! What you said afterwards does not agree with what you said before, nor does what you said before agree with what you said afterwards. Yet you made this statement: ‘I will debate on the basis of truth, venerable sir, so let us have some conversation about this.’”
“Venerable sir, although the Blessed One has spoken thus, yet the bodily rod is the most reprehensible for the performance of evil action, for the perpetration of evil action, and not so much the verbal rod and the mental rod.”
13. “What do you think, householder? Is this town of Nāḷandā successful and prosperous, is it populous and crowded with people?”
“Yes, venerable sir, it is.”
“What do you think, householder? Suppose a man came here brandishing a sword and spoke thus: ‘In one moment, in one instant, I will make all the living beings in this town of Nāḷandā into one mass of flesh, into one heap of flesh.’ What do you think, householder, would that man be able to do that?”
“Venerable sir, ten, twenty, thirty, forty, or even fifty men would not be able to make all the living beings in this town of Nāḷandā into one mass of flesh, into one heap of flesh in one moment or instant, so what does a single trivial man count for?”
“What do you think, householder? Suppose some recluse or brahmin came here possessed of supernormal power and attained to mastery of mind, and he spoke thus: ‘I will reduce this town of Nāḷandā to ashes with one mental act of hate.’ What do you think, householder, would such a recluse or brahmin be able to do that?” [378]
“Venerable sir, such a recluse or brahmin possessed of supernormal power and attained to mastery of mind would be able to reduce ten, twenty, thirty, forty, or even fifty Nāḷandās to ashes with one mental act of hate, so what does a single trivial Nāḷandā count for?”
“Householder, householder, pay attention how you reply! What you said afterwards does not agree with what you said before, nor does what you said before agree with what you said afterwards. Yet you made this statement: ‘I will debate on the basis of truth, venerable sir, so let us have some conversation about this.’”
“Venerable sir, although the Blessed One has spoken thus, yet the bodily rod is the most reprehensible for the performance of evil action, for the perpetration of evil action, and not so much the verbal rod and the mental rod.”
14. “What do you think, householder? Have you heard how the Daṇḍaka, Kālinga, Mejjha, and Mātanga forests became forests?”587—“Yes, venerable sir.”—“As you heard it, how did they become forests?”—“Venerable sir, I heard that they became forests by means of a mental act of hate on the part of the seers.”
“Householder, householder, pay attention how you reply! What you said before does not agree with what you said afterwards, nor does what you said afterwards agree with what you said before. Yet you made this statement: ‘I will debate on the basis of truth, venerable sir, so let us have some conversation about this.’”
15. “Venerable sir, I was satisfied and pleased by the Blessed One’s very first simile. Nevertheless, I thought I would oppose the Blessed One thus since I desired to hear the Blessed One’s varied solutions to the problem. Magnificent, venerable sir! Magnificent, venerable sir! The Blessed One has made the Dhamma clear in many ways, as though he were turning upright what had been overthrown, revealing what was hidden, showing the way to one who was lost, or holding up a lamp in the dark for those with eyesight to see forms. Venerable sir, I go to the Blessed One for refuge [379] and to the Dhamma and to the Sangha of bhikkhus. Let the Blessed One remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for refuge for life.”
16. “Investigate thoroughly, householder. It is good for such well-known people like you to investigate thoroughly.”
“Venerable sir, I am even more satisfied and pleased with the Blessed One for telling me that. For the other sectarians, on acquiring me as their disciple, would carry a banner all over Nāḷandā announcing: ‘The householder Upāli has come to discipleship under us.’ But, on the contrary, the Blessed One tells me: ‘Investigate thoroughly, householder. It is good for such well-known people like you to investigate thoroughly.’ So for the second time, venerable sir, I go to the Blessed One for refuge and to the Dhamma and to the Sangha of bhikkhus. Let the Blessed One remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for refuge for life.”
17. “Householder, your family has long supported the Nigaṇṭhas and you should consider that alms should be given to them when they come.”
“Venerable sir, I am even more satisfied and pleased with the Blessed One for telling me that. Venerable sir, I have heard that the recluse Gotama says thus: ‘Gifts should be given only to me; gifts should not be given to others. Gifts should be given only to my disciples; gifts should not be given to others’ disciples. Only what is given to me is very fruitful, not what is given to others. Only what is given to my disciples is very fruitful, not what is given to others’ disciples.’ But, on the contrary, the Blessed One encourages me to give gifts to the Nigaṇṭhas. Anyway we shall know the time for that, venerable sir. So for the third time, venerable sir, I go to the Blessed One for refuge and to the Dhamma and to the Sangha of bhikkhus. Let the Blessed One remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for refuge for life.”
18. Then the Blessed One gave the householder Upāli progressive instruction, that is, talk on giving, talk on virtue, talk on the heavens; he explained the danger, degradation, and defilement in sensual pleasures and the blessing of renunciation. When he knew that the householder Upāli’s mind [380] was ready, receptive, free from hindrances, elated, and confident, he expounded to him the teaching special to the Buddhas: suffering, its origin, its cessation, and the path. Just as a clean cloth with all marks removed would take dye evenly, so too, while the householder Upāli sat there, the spotless immaculate vision of the Dhamma arose in him: “All that is subject to arising is subject to cessation.” 588 Then the householder Upāli saw the Dhamma, attained the Dhamma, understood the Dhamma, fathomed the Dhamma; he crossed beyond doubt, did away with perplexity, gained intrepidity, and became independent of others in the Teacher’s Dispensation.589 Then he said to the Blessed One: “Now, venerable sir, we must go. We are busy and have much to do.”
“You may go, householder, at your own convenience.”
19. Then the householder Upāli, having delighted and rejoiced in the Blessed One’s words, rose from his seat, and after paying homage to the Blessed One, keeping him on his right, he left to return to his own house. There he addressed the doorkeeper thus: “Good doorkeeper, from today on I close my door to the Nigaṇṭhas and the Nigaṇṭhīs, and I open my door to the Blessed One’s bhikkhus, bhikkhunīs, men lay followers, and women lay followers. If any Nigaṇṭha comes, then tell him thus: ‘Wait, venerable sir, do not enter. From today on the householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama. He has closed his door to the Nigaṇṭhas and Nigaṇṭhīs, and he has opened it to the Blessed One’s bhikkhus, bhikkhunīs, men lay followers, and women lay followers. Venerable sir, if you need alms, wait here; they will bring it to you here.’”—“Yes, venerable sir,” the doorkeeper replied.
20. The Nigaṇṭha Dīgha Tapassī heard: “The householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama.” Then he went to the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta and told him: “Venerable sir, I have heard thus: ‘The householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama.’”
“It is impossible, Tapassī, it cannot ha
ppen that the householder Upāli should go over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama; but it is possible, it can happen that the recluse Gotama might come over to discipleship under the householder Upāli.” [381]
A second time…And a third time the Nigaṇṭha Dīgha Tapassī told the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta: “Venerable sir, I have heard thus: ‘The householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama.’”
“It is impossible, Tapassī, it cannot happen…”
“Venerable sir, shall I go and find out whether or not the householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama?”
“Go, Tapassī, and find out whether or not he has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama.”
21. Then the Nigaṇṭha Dīgha Tapassī went to the householder Upāli’s house. The doorkeeper saw him coming in the distance and told him: “Wait, venerable sir, do not enter. From today on the householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama. He has closed his door to the Nigaṇṭhas and Nigaṇṭhīs, and he has opened it to the Blessed One’s bhikkhus, bhikkhunīs, men lay followers, and women lay followers. Venerable sir, if you need alms, wait here; they will bring it to you here.”
“I do not need alms, friend,” he said, and he turned back and went to the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta and told him: “Venerable sir, it is only too true that the householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama. Venerable sir, I did not get your consent when I told you: ‘Venerable sir, I do not agree that the householder Upāli should [try to] refute the recluse Gotama’s doctrine. For the recluse Gotama is a magician and knows a converting magic by which he converts disciples of knows a converting magic by which he converts disciples of other sectarians.’ And now, venerable sir, your householder Upāli has been converted by the recluse Gotama with his converting magic!”
“It is impossible, Tapassī, it cannot happen that the householder Upāli should go over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama; but it is possible, it can happen that the recluse Gotama might come over to discipleship under the householder Upāli.”
A second time…And a third time the Nigaṇṭha Dīgha Tapassī told the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta: “Venerable sir, it is only too true that the householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama [382]…with his converting magic!”
“It is impossible, Tapassī, it cannot happen…it can happen that the recluse Gotama might come over to discipleship under the householder Upāli. Now I shall go myself and find out whether or not he has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama.”
22. Then the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta went with a large assembly of Nigaṇṭhas to the householder Upāli’s house. The doorkeeper saw him coming in the distance and told him: “Wait, venerable sir, do not enter. From today on the householder Upāli has gone over to discipleship under the recluse Gotama. He has closed his door to the Nigaṇṭhas and Nigaṇṭhīs, and he has opened his door to the Blessed One’s bhikkhus, bhikkhunīs, men lay followers, and women lay followers. Venerable sir, if you need alms, wait here; they will bring it to you here.”
“Good doorkeeper, go to the householder Upāli and tell him: ‘Venerable sir, the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta is standing at the outer gate with a large assembly of Nigaṇṭhas; he wishes to see you.’”
“Yes, venerable sir,” he replied, and he went to the householder Upāli and told him: “Venerable sir, the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta is standing at the outer gate with a large assembly of Nigaṇṭhas; he wishes to see you.”
“In that case, good doorkeeper, make seats ready in the hall of the central door.”
“Yes, venerable sir,” he replied, and after he had made seats ready in the hall of the central door, he returned to the householder Upāli and told him: “Venerable sir, the seats are made ready in the hall of the central door. You may come at your own convenience.”
23. Then the householder Upāli [383] went to the hall of the central door and sat down on the highest, best, chief, most excellent seat there. Then he told the doorkeeper: “Now, good doorkeeper, go to the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta and tell him: ‘Venerable sir, the householder Upāli says: “Enter, venerable sir, if you wish.”’”
“Yes, venerable sir,” he replied, and he went to the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta and told him: “Venerable sir, the householder Upāli says: ‘Enter, venerable sir, if you wish.’”
Then the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta went with the large assembly of Nigaṇṭhas to the hall of the central door.
24. Previously, when the householder Upāli saw the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta coming in the distance, he used to go out to meet him, dust off the highest, best, chief, most excellent seat there with an upper robe, and having arranged it all around, have him seated on it. But now, while seated himself on the highest, best, chief, most excellent seat, he told Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta: “Venerable sir, there are seats; sit down if you wish.”
25. When this was said, the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta said: “Householder, you are mad, you are an imbecile. You went saying: ‘Venerable sir, I shall refute the recluse Gotama’s doctrine,’ and you have come back caught by the vast net of his doctrine. Just as if a man went to castrate someone and came back castrated himself, just as if a man went to put out someone’s eyes and came back with his own eyes put out; so you too, householder, went saying: ‘Venerable sir, I shall refute the recluse Gotama’s doctrine,’ and you have come back caught by the vast net of his doctrine. Householder, you have been converted by the recluse Gotama with his converting magic!”
26. “Auspicious is that converting magic, venerable sir, good is that converting magic!590 Venerable sir, if my beloved kinsmen and relatives were to be converted by this conversion, it would lead to the welfare and happiness of my beloved kinsmen and relatives for a long time. If all nobles were to be converted by this conversion, it would lead to the welfare and happiness of the nobles for a long time. [384] If all brahmins…all merchants… all workers were to be converted by this conversion, it would lead to the welfare and happiness of the workers for a long time. If the world with its gods, its Māras, and its Brahmās, this generation with its recluses and brahmins, its princes and its people, were to be converted by this conversion, it would lead to the welfare and happiness of the world for a long time. As to this, venerable sir, I shall give you a simile; for some wise men here understand the meaning of a statement by a simile.
27. “Venerable sir, there was once a brahmin who was old, aged, and burdened with years, and he had as a wife a young brahmin girl who was pregnant and near her confinement. Then she told him: ‘Go, brahmin, buy a young monkey in the market and bring it back to me as a playmate for my child.’ He replied: ‘Wait, madam, till you have borne the child. If you bear a boy, then I will go to the market and buy a young male monkey and bring it back to you as a playmate for your little boy; but if you bear a girl, then I will go to the market and buy a young female monkey and bring it back to you as a playmate for your little girl.’ For the second time she made the same request and received the same answer. For the third time she made the same request. Then, since his mind was bound to her with love, he went to the market, bought a young male monkey, brought it back, and told her: ‘I have bought this young male monkey in the market [385] and brought it back to you as a playmate for your child.’ Then she told him: ‘Go, brahmin, take this young male monkey to Rattapāṇi the dyer’s son and tell him: “Good Rattapāṇi, I want this young male monkey dyed the colour called yellow-unguent, pounded and re-pounded, and smoothened out on both sides.”’ Then, since his mind was bound to her with love, he took the young male monkey to Rattapāṇi the dyer’s son and told him: ‘Good Rattapāṇi, I want this young male monkey dyed the colour called yellow-unguent, pounded and re-pounded, and smoothened out on both sides.’ Rattapāṇi the dyer’s son told him: ‘Venerable sir, this young male monkey will take a dyeing but not a pounding or a smoothening out.
’ So too, venerable sir, the doctrine of the foolish Nigaṇṭhas will give delight to fools but not to the wise, and it will not withstand testing or being smoothened out.
“Then, venerable sir, on another occasion that brahmin took a pair of new garments to Rattapāṇi the dyer’s son and told him: ‘Good Rattapāṇi, I want this pair of new garments dyed the colour called yellow-unguent, pounded and re-pounded, and smoothened out on both sides.’ Rattapāṇi the dyer’s son told him: ‘Venerable sir, this pair of new garments will take a dyeing and a pounding and a smoothening out.’ So too, venerable sir, the doctrine of that Blessed One, accomplished and fully enlightened, will give delight to the wise but not to fools, and it will withstand testing and being smoothened out.”
28. “Householder, the assembly and the king know you thus: ‘The householder Upāli is a disciple of the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta.’ Whose disciple should we consider you to be?”
When this was said, the householder Upāli rose from his seat, and arranging his upper robe on one shoulder, [386] he extended his hands in reverential salutation in the direction of the Blessed One and told the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta:
The Middle Length Discourses of the Buddha Page 53
