42. When this was said, the brahmin student Sangārava said to the Blessed One: “Master Gotama’s striving was unfaltering, Master Gotama’s striving was that of a true man, as it should be for an Accomplished One, a Fully Enlightened One. But how is it, Master Gotama, are there gods?”
“It is known to me to be the case, Bhāradvāja, that there are gods.”
“But how is this, Master Gotama, that when you are asked, ‘Are there gods?’ you say: ‘It is known to me to be the case, Bhāradvāja, that there are gods’? If that is so, isn’t what you say empty and false?”921
“Bhāradvāja, when one is asked, ‘Are there gods?’ [213] whether one answers, ‘There are gods,’ or ‘It is known to me to be the case [that there are gods],’ a wise man can draw the definite conclusion that there are gods.”
“But why didn’t Master Gotama answer me in the first way?”
“It is widely accepted in the world, Bhāradvāja, that there are gods.”
43. When this was said, the brahmin student Sangārava said to the Blessed One: “Magnificent, Master Gotama! Magnificent, Master Gotama! Master Gotama has made the Dhamma clear in many ways, as though he were turning upright what had been overturned, revealing what was hidden, showing the way to one who was lost, or holding up a lamp in the dark for those with eyesight to see forms. I go to Master Gotama for refuge and to the Dhamma and to the Sangha of bhikkhus. Let Master Gotama remember me as a lay follower who has gone to him for refuge for life.”
Part Three
The Final Fifty Discourses
(Uparipaṇṇāsapāḷi)
1
The Division at Devadaha
(Devadahavagga)
Devadaha Sutta
At Devadaha
[214] 1. THUS HAVE I HEARD. On one occasion the Blessed One was living in the Sakyan country where there was a town of the Sakyans named Devadaha. There the Blessed One addressed the bhikkhus thus: “Bhikkhus.”—“Venerable sir,” they replied. The Blessed One said this:
2. “Bhikkhus, there are some recluses and brahmins who hold such a doctrine and view as this: ‘Whatever this person feels, whether pleasure or pain or neither-pain-nor-pleasure, all that is caused by what was done in the past.922 So by annihilating with asceticism past actions923 and by doing no fresh actions, there will be no consequence in the future. With no consequence in the future, there is the destruction of action. With the destruction of action, there is the destruction of suffering. With the destruction of suffering, there is the destruction of feeling. With the destruction of feeling, all suffering will be exhausted.’ So speak the Nigaṇṭhas, bhikkhus.
3. “I go to the Nigaṇṭhas who speak thus and I say: ‘Friend Nigaṇṭhas, is it true that you hold such a doctrine and view as this: “Whatever this person feels…all suffering will be exhausted”?’ If, when they are asked thus, the Nigaṇṭhas admit this and say ‘Yes,’ I say to them:
4. “‘But, friends, do you know that you existed in the past, and that it is not the case that you did not exist?’—‘No, friend.’—‘But, friends, do you know that you did evil actions in the past and did not abstain from them?’—‘No, friend.’—‘But, friends, do you know that you did such and such evil actions?’—‘No, friend.’—‘But, friends, do you know that so much suffering has already been exhausted, or that so much suffering has still to be exhausted, or that when so much suffering has been exhausted all suffering will have been exhausted?’—[215] ‘No, friend.’—‘But, friends, do you know what the abandoning of unwholesome states is and what the cultivation of wholesome states is here and now?’—‘No, friend.’
5. “‘So, friends, it seems that you do not know that you existed in the past and that it is not the case that you did not exist; or that you did evil actions in the past and did not abstain from them; or that you did such and such evil actions; or that so much suffering has already been exhausted, or that so much suffering has still to be exhausted, or that when so much suffering has been exhausted all suffering will have been exhausted; or what the abandoning of unwholesome states is and what the cultivation of wholesome states is here and now. That being so, it is not fitting for the venerable Nigaṇṭhas to declare: “Whatever this person feels, whether pleasure or pain or neither-pain-nor-pleasure, all that is caused by what was done in the past. So by annihilating with asceticism past actions and by doing no fresh actions, there will be no consequence in the future. With no consequence in the future…all suffering will be exhausted.”
6. “‘If, friend Nigaṇṭhas, you knew that you existed in the past and that it is not the case that you did not exist; or that you did evil actions in the past and did not abstain from them; or that you did such and such evil actions; or that so much suffering has already been exhausted, or that so much suffering has still to be exhausted, or that when so much suffering has been exhausted all suffering will have been exhausted; or what the abandoning of unwholesome states is and what the cultivation of wholesome states is here and now; that being so, it would be fitting for the venerable Nigaṇṭhas to declare: “Whatever this person feels…[216]…all suffering will be exhausted.”
7. “‘Friend Nigaṇṭhas, suppose a man were wounded by an arrow thickly smeared with poison, and because of this he felt painful, racking, piercing feelings. Then his friends and companions, kinsmen and relatives, brought a surgeon. The surgeon would cut around the opening of the wound with a knife, probe for the arrow with a probe, pull out the arrow, and apply a medicinal powder to the opening of the wound, and at each step the man would feel painful, racking, piercing feelings. Then on a later occasion, when the wound was healed and covered with skin, the man would be well and happy, independent, master of himself, able to go where he likes. He might think: “Formerly I was pierced by an arrow thickly smeared with poison, and because of this I felt painful, racking, piercing feelings. Then my friends and companions, kinsmen and relatives, brought a surgeon. The surgeon cut around the opening of the wound with a knife, probed for the arrow with a probe, pulled out the arrow, and applied a medicinal powder to the opening of the wound, and at each step I felt painful, racking, piercing feelings. [217] But now that the wound is healed and covered with skin, I am well and happy, independent, my own master, able to go where I like.”
8. “‘So too, friend Nigaṇṭhas, if you knew that you existed in the past and that it is not the case that you did not exist…or what the abandoning of unwholesome states is and what the cultivation of wholesome states is here and now; that being so, it would be fitting for the venerableNigaṇṭhas to declare: “Whatever this person feels…all suffering will be exhausted.”
9. “‘But since, friend Nigaṇṭhas, you do not know that you existed in the past and that it is not the case that you did not exist…or what the abandoning of unwholesome states is and what the cultivation of wholesome states is here and now, it is not fitting for the venerable Nigaṇṭhas to declare: “Whatever this person feels…all suffering will be exhausted.”’
10. “When this was said, the Nigaṇṭhas told me: [218] ‘Friend, the Nigaṇṭha Nātaputta is omniscient and all-seeing and claims to have complete knowledge and vision thus: “Whether I am walking or standing or asleep or awake, knowledge and vision are continuously and uninterruptedly present to me.” He says thus: “Nigaṇṭhas, you have done evil actions in the past; exhaust them with the performance of piercing austerities. And when you are here and now restrained in body, speech, and mind, that is doing no evil actions for the future. So by annihilating with asceticism past actions and by doing no fresh actions, there will be no consequence in the future. With no consequence in the future…all suffering will be exhausted.” We approve of and accept this, and so we are satisfied.’
11. “When this was said, I told the Nigaṇṭhas:924 ‘There are five things, friend Nigaṇṭhas, that may turn out in two different ways here and now. What five? They are: faith, approval, oral tradition, reasoned cogitation, and reflective acceptance of a view. T
hese five things may turn out in two different ways here and now. Herein, what kind of faith do the venerable Nigaṇṭhas have in a teacher who speaks about the past? What kind of approval, what kind of oral tradition, what kind of reasoned cogitation, what kind of reflective acceptance of a view?’ Speaking thus, bhikkhus, I did not see any legitimate defence of their position by the Nigaṇṭhas.
12. “Again, bhikkhus, I said to the Nigaṇṭhas: ‘What do you think, friend Nigaṇṭhas? When there is intense exertion, intense striving, do you then feel painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion? But when there is no intense exertion, no intense striving, do you then not feel any painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion?’—‘When there is intense exertion, friend Gotama, intense striving, then we feel painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion; [219] but when there is no intense exertion, no intense striving, then we do not feel any painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion.’
13. “‘So it seems, friend Nigaṇṭhas, that when there is intense exertion…you feel painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion; but when there is no intense exertion…you do not feel any painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion. That being so, it is not fitting for the venerable Nigaṇṭhas to declare:925 “Whatever this person feels, whether pleasure or pain or neither-pain-nor-pleasure, all that is caused by what was done in the past. So by annihilating with asceticism past actions and by doing no fresh actions, there will be no consequence in the future. With no consequence…all suffering will be exhausted.”
14. “‘If, friend Nigaṇṭhas, when there was intense exertion, intense striving, then painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion were present, and when there was no intense exertion, no intense striving, then painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion were still present; that being so, it would be fitting for the venerable Nigaṇṭhas to declare: “Whatever this person feels…all suffering will be exhausted.”
15. “‘But since, friend Nigaṇṭhas, when there is intense exertion, intense striving, then you feel painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion, but when there is no intense exertion, no intense striving, then you do not feel painful, racking, piercing feelings due to intense exertion, you are therefore feeling only the painful, racking, piercing feelings of your self-imposed exertion, and it is through ignorance, unknowing, and delusion [220] that you mistakenly hold: “Whatever this person feels…all suffering will be exhausted.”’ Speaking thus, bhikkhus, I did not see any legitimate defence of their position by the Nigaṇṭhas.
16. “Again, bhikkhus, I said to the Nigaṇṭhas: ‘What do you think, friend Nigaṇṭhas? Is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced here and now926 can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced in the next life?’—‘No, friend.’—‘But is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced in the next life can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced here and now?’—‘No, friend.’
17. “‘What do you think, friend Nigaṇṭhas? Is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced as pleasant can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced as painful?’—‘No, friend.’—‘But is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced as painful can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced as pleasant?’—‘No, friend.’
18. “‘What do you think, friend Nigaṇṭhas? Is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced in a matured [personality] can, by exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced in an unmatured [personality]?’927—‘No, friend.’—‘But is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced in an unmatured [personality] can, by exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced in a matured personality?’—‘No, friend.’
19. “‘What do you think, friend Nigaṇṭhas? [221] Is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be much experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be little experienced?’—‘No, friend.’—‘But is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be little experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be much experienced?’—‘No, friend.’
20. “‘What do you think, friend Nigaṇṭhas? Is it possible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is not to be experienced? ’928—‘No, friend.’—‘But is it possible that an action [whose result] is not to be experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced?’—‘No, friend.’
21. “‘So it seems, friend Nigaṇṭhas, that it is impossible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced here and now can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced in the next life, and impossible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced in the next life can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced here and now; impossible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced as pleasant can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced as painful, and impossible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced as painful can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced as pleasant; impossible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced in a matured [personality] can, by exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced in an unmatured [personality], and impossible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced in an unmatured [personality] can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced in a matured [personality]; impossible that an action [whose result] is to be much experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be little experienced, and impossible that an action [whose result] is to be little experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be much experienced; impossible that an action [whose result] is to be experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is not to be experienced, and impossible that an action [whose result] is not to be experienced can, through exertion and striving, become one [whose result] is to be experienced. That being so, the venerable Nigaṇṭhas’ exertion is fruitless, [222] their striving is fruitless.’
22. “So speak the Nigaṇṭhas, bhikkhus. And because the Nigaṇṭhas speak thus, there are ten legitimate deductions from their assertions that provide ground for censuring them:
(1) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by what was done in the past, then the Nigaṇṭhas surely must have done bad deeds in the past, since they now feel such painful, racking, piercing feelings.
(2) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by the creative act of a Supreme God,929 then the Nigaṇṭhas surely must have been created by an evil Supreme God, since they now feel such painful, racking, piercing feelings.
(3) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by circumstance and nature,930 then the Nigaṇṭhas surely must have bad luck, since they now feel such painful, racking, piercing feelings.
(4) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by class [among the six classes of birth],931 then the Nigaṇṭhas surely must belong to a bad class, since they now feel such painful, racking, piercing feelings.
(5) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by exertion here and now, then the Nigaṇṭhas surely must strive badly here and now, since they now feel such painful, racking, piercing feelings.
(6) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by what was done in the past, then the Nigaṇṭhas are to be censured; if not, then the Nigaṇṭhas are still to be censured.
(7) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by the creative act of a
Supreme God, then the Nigaṇṭhas are to be censured; if not, they are still to be censured.
(8) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by chance, then the Nigaṇṭhas are to be censured; if not, they are still to be censured.
(9) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by class, then the Nigaṇṭhas are to be censured; if not, they are still to be censured.
(10) “If the pleasure and pain that beings feel are caused by exertion here and now, [223] then the Nigaṇṭhas are to be censured; if not, they are still to be censured.
“So speak the Nigaṇṭhas, bhikkhus. And because the Nigaṇṭhas speak thus, these ten legitimate deductions from their assertions provide grounds for censuring them. Thus their exertion is fruitless, their striving is fruitless.
23. “And how is exertion fruitful, bhikkhus, how is striving fruitful? Here, bhikkhus, a bhikkhu who is not overwhelmed with suffering does not overwhelm himself with suffering; and he does not give up the pleasure that accords with Dhamma, yet he is not infatuated with that pleasure. 932 He knows thus: ‘When I strive with determination, this particular source of suffering fades away in me because of that determined striving; and when I look on with equanimity, this particular source of suffering fades away in me while I develop equanimity.’933 He strives with determination in regard to that particular source of suffering which fades away in him because of that determined striving; and he develops equanimity in regard to that particular source of suffering which fades away in him while he is developing equanimity. When he strives with determination, such and such a source of suffering fades away in him because of that determined striving; thus that suffering is exhausted in him. When he looks on with equanimity, such and such a source of suffering fades away in him while he develops equanimity; thus that suffering is exhausted in him.
The Middle Length Discourses of the Buddha Page 91
