Sitting quietly Isaac formulates strategy for his next foray. His thoughts become hard to formulate and disjointed, as the gentle rocking of the truck once again overwhelms his consciousness with its soothing affect and he is overcome with slumber. His rest is only partial and fleeting as his mind is filled with the thoughts of how to set up his next point of debate. Waking with a new challenge in mind, Isaac starts another sparring round with a pointed question shot at Adam.
“Are you saying that it doesn't matter what you believe as long as you believe in and accept Jesus?
Startled by Isaac's sudden attentiveness, Adam pauses for a moment considering his reply. He adjusts the cab heat and simultaneously checks for traffic in his mirrors. “It depends what you understand the plan of God to be,” replies Adam. “Do you believe that accepting Jesus as your Savior and eternal life in heaven, is the extent of God’s plan for humanity? Or do you believe we are called to receive eternal life, as well as rewards in God's kingdom as true sons of God. We receive those rewards by developing our talents and by growing in the Spirit of God during this life.
I believe God will reward us for how well we overcome now, in this life. It does matter what you believe, because not fully understanding God or his plans for humanity, will affect how you interact with people around you. It will affect how you show the love of God to the world. Even though you may be saved, you could be misleading others about the Kingdom of God.
As Christians we are to develop the fruit of the spirit and become more like God. We do this by wrestling with our human nature, now is our time for growth. The better we know the Bible the better we will know God.” Adam throws in a quote from the Bible. “’Do your best to win full approval in God's sight, as a worker who is not ashamed of his work, one who correctly teaches the message of God's truth’.”
“Yes!” Isaac exclaims. “So we must preach to this sinful world so that they will be able to repent and save their souls from eternal torment in the fires of Hell?” Isaac says expanding on Adam's thought. “We should preach Jesus to the world to win those lost souls for the Lord and gain a better reward for ourselves.”
Adam shoots a glance at Isaac and says with a frown. “That's not what I was getting at. I was talking about Christians being rewarded by God, for their personal growth, once they are in the kingdom. We need to be skillful in correctly teaching the word of God to others so that we won’t be ashamed of our workmanship of proclaiming the Kingdom of God.”
Isaac responds impatiently. “As long as people hear the message of Jesus and accept him as their Savior to gain eternal life, that is all that is needed to save them from eternal torment in Hell. That is the prime work of the faithful.”
Defiant, Isaac leans back in his chair where he is again overcome by the trucks gentle rocking motion and the heat of the cab. Another wave of exhaustion and relaxation washes over him like an narcoleptic wave. Without warning he is suspended in a jittery, twitchy sleep, his head tipped against the passenger door window in what has now become a familiar pose.
Having plenty of time to formulate his rebuttal, Adam waits patiently as he keeps the truck safely rolling down the highway. “It appears to me that you believe Satan’s lie.” Adam loudly picks up the conversation where they had left off when Isaac finally awakens with a snort.
“What lie is that?” Isaac replies groggily, wiping the drool from his chin. “Why would I believe anything that Satan tells me?” Isaac demands sharply.
“Well, your statement that those who don't accept Jesus will be tortured eternally in the fires of hell. Or did I misunderstand you? It leads me to believe that you have been duped by Satan along with the majority of mankind,” explained Adam.
“Yes, that is what I meant. The unsaved will be tormented in Hell for all eternity, but that is not a satanic lie. It's a biblical fact.” Isaac said certifying his beliefs, as the true biblical record.
“Then yes, you do believe the lie Satan told Eve in the Garden of Eden. ‘You shall not surely die.’ That was the original lie, told by the father of lies and mankind has believed it ever since,” Adam said confidently.
“What lie? What are you talking about? We all die physically, but our souls live on. ‘The Spirit goes back to God who gave it’. Our spirits are entrusted to be with God when we die, our spirit is immortal, many Bible verses explain that to us. Haven't you ever read them in the Bible?” Isaac asks Adam in mocking sarcasm, astonished with Adam’s ignorance of basic Christian doctrine.
“No, actually I never could find that taught in my bible. Maybe you could help me find where it's written. I've heard it being taught in sermons and I know people talk about that notion, but I have not read that anywhere in the Bible,” Adam was speaking with a slight hint of sarcasm himself; his eyes were wide giving him a lost puppy look.
“Well OK, let’s start with the verse that I have already referred too. The spirit goes back to God. I'll look it up.” Isaac's fingers are in a flurry over the key board. “Here it is,
Ecclesiastes 12:7 KJV. Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
This is telling us that when we die our Spirit goes back to God. That is strait forward to understand. Don't you see? Man was created as a body out of the ground and then God breathed into him, the spirit, and he became a living soul. We have two separate parts, body and soul. Soul is also referred to as the spirit and here we are told it goes back to God when we die,” Isaac is trying to use his best professorial voice.
“I do see the words your reading, however I don't think you got the proper meaning for them,” Adam retorts.
“What do you mean? What other possible explanation could there be,” Isaac inquires.
“It all goes back to the beginning,” said Adam, doing his best to explain. “If your understanding is wrong just a bit at the start, then you will not understand other things correctly later on.
Like surveying land, if you’re half a degree off to start with, after a thousand miles you will be a long way from the intended mark. That's what Satan did, he mislead mankind at the start about ourselves and that has led mankind away from God and the plans God has for us ever since.”
“Your big on conspiracy theories aren’t you?” Isaac says, jokingly sarcastic this time.
“Not normally, but this is the biggest one ever,” Adam admits. “It all started in the Garden of Eden. Satan lies to Eve. He tells her she would not die. He misdirects her away from god, by framing his lie in the truth that the tree of knowledge would make her wise. You can read this in Geneses.”
Isaac looks up the passage. He starts to read just as Adam finishes speaking. “I will read the entire story for context.” Isaac starts to read animatedly for affect.
“Genesis 3:1-7
Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the Lord God had made. And he said unto the woman, Yea, hath God said, Ye shall not eat of every tree of the garden?
2 And the woman said unto the serpent, We may eat of the fruit of the trees of the garden:
3 But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.
4 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
5 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
7 And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.
Ya.” Isaac said out loud as if reading the story for the first time. “So the lie was in verse 4. He told her she would not die contrary to what God had told her in verse 3,” Reverting to traditional teaching Isaac continue
s. “But God meant that she would not die physically. They could have lived in Eden forever without sin. God created Adam with an immortal soul at creation. Here I will read it to you.
Genesis 2:7 KJV. And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
See? Man was made physical and with an immortal soul.”
Confidently Adam counters the point and directs Isaac to find more information. “If you already had the idea that we have an immortal soul you might believe that, but if you analyze that verse you will find it doesn't say what you think it does. The word Soul is translated from the Hebrew word nephesh. That is the same word used to describe all the rest of the animals created on the fifth day. Look up the meaning and usage in the Strong's Concordance.”
Finding the requested material Isaac starts to read the dry subject matter methodically out loud.
“ nephesh neh'-fesh
From H5314; properly a breathing creature, that is, animal or (abstractly) vitality; used very widely in a literal, accommodated or figurative sense (bodily or mental)
KJV Usage: any, appetite, beast, body, breath, creature, X dead (-ly), desire, X [dis-] contented, X fish, ghost, + greedy, he, heart (-y), (hath, X jeopardy of) life (X in jeopardy), lust, man, me, mind, mortality,”
Isaac says with a loud yawn.
“There! See.” Adam quickly interjects, silencing Isaac. “The King James translators used nephesh to mean MORTAL. Not Immortal.” He places emphasis on the word mortal. “The KJV translators knew that the verse was not saying man had an Immortal soul as most Christians think.”
Thoughtfully Isaac continues reading the concordance.
“one, own, person, pleasure, (her-, him-, my-, thy-) self, them (your) -selves, + slay, soul, + tablet, they, thing, (X she) will, X would have it. Brown-Driver-Briggs' Hebrew Definitions
1.soul, self, life, creature, person, appetite, mind, living being, desire, emotion, passion
a. that which breathes, the breathing substance or being, soul, the inner being of man
b. living being
c. living being (with life in the blood)
d. the man himself, self, person or individual
e. seat of the appetites
f. seat of emotions and passions
g. activity of mind
1. dubious
h. activity of the will
1. dubious
i. activity of the character
1. Dubious
That covers it. It did talk about Soul being our inner man, and the seat of our apatite’s, desires, emotions and passions.” Isaac points out for clarity, trying to ignore Adam’s point about humans being created mortal.
Noticing the vibrations coming from the passenger seat he was sitting in were intensifying rapidly, along with the shrill howl of the wind from the cabs windows, and the deafening rumble of the Jake brake becoming overbearing, Isaac is forced to take notice of the old trucks increasing speed.
He couldn’t see it clearly through the steering wheel spokes, but thought he saw the speedometer needle pointing towards the two o’clock position. Looking up he could see the freeway dropping down before them in a steep decline. Nervously clutching onto the armrest of his chair, he looks at Adam calmly resting his elbow on the window ledge, lightly touching two fingers on the steering wheel.
Having reached the top of the engines RPM range, Adam casually skip-shifts into his highest gear. The barking of the exhaust is quietened, but Isaac is alarmed that now the old truck is picking up speed even faster, as if they were in free-fall towards the bottom of the hill that Isaac could see stretched out more than a mile away below them. The calmness of Adam gives him no comfort as beads of sweat form on his brow. Soon the Jake brake is once again screaming out its rumbling song and the speedo needle was pointing towards where five o’clock would be.
Isaac is pushed hard to the left against his armrest as they round a sweeping right hand curve. Shaking violently they bounce onto a wide four lane bridge at the bottom of the hill. Looking out the side window he recognizes the river below them, as the old truck crosses over the bridge at a frantic pace. Trying to be as calm as Adam, Isaac nonchalantly asks. “Wow this trip is really going by fast. Isn't that the river just west of Merit?”
“It sure is. You have been either asleep or busy typing the whole trip. Don't you remember pulling up Snow Shed hill? We flew up it, passing all the other trucks. This old girl has got lots of legs,” Adam says proudly. “It’s been a real roller coaster run, ‘up to slow, down to fast’. Being empty like today though, it's just been fast and then faster.”
Soon after crossing the bridge the speed of the truck is lost as Adam presses lightly on the throttle, letting the truck coast most of the way up the next hill. “See it all averages out.” Adam says smiling. “Fuel efficiency, let gravity work for you.” The truck is soon back to making its usual tremors and groans that Isaac had become accustomed too.
Yet again Isaac is confounded by Adam's trucker slang. “What is he talking about? Well at least he isn't swearing,” he thinks to himself. Faking a smile and nodding knowingly, Isaac waits for Adam to get back to their biblical conversation that had him gripped and seemed to be consuming him.
“Yes soul is that for sure, those things make us different than animals. In that sense, it could be referred to as our human spirit, personality, or will. However those things don't give us eternal life.” Adam continues to push his point. “The soul refers to our body just as readily. Beast, body, creature, things with breath, they are all referred to with the same word nephesh. We are lumped together with all creatures that have the breath of life, but those other creatures aren’t thought to have an immortal soul. This verse in no way teaches that man has an immortal soul, only that we are no better than an animal. We are told later on in the Bible that we all go to the same place and have no preeminence over a beast.”
Checking the reference, Isaac types hurriedly then starts to read.
“Ecclesiastes 3:19-21 KJV.
19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.
20 All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.
21 Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?
This is talking about our bodies being the same, not our souls! And see the man's spirit is going up,” contends Isaac.
“It is asking a question, who knoweth, not making a statement. Plus you keep referring to our soul as if it were something special.” Adam points out. “Where do you get that belief and teaching from in the Bible. Where are your scriptural references for proof? It wasn't in Genesis 2:7 like you thought.” Adam continues to press for confirmation. “If there is any doubt about Adam being created with eternal life or immortality then the account of him being driven out of the Garden of Eden should dispel it.”
Again Isaac is finding and preparing to scrutinize the reference as he reads them aloud.
“Genesis 3:22-24
And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
23 Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
24 So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
What's your point? I don't see it. They were driven out from the garden because of their sin, that's all I get,” Isaac declares, giving Adam a curious look.
“Don't you see it? They were like God knowing good from evil but they were kept away from the tree of life by Cherubims. That means th
ey did not possess eternal life at that time. Otherwise it would have done God no good to keep them from the tree of life as they would have no need of its fruit. They would already be able to live forever if they had an immortal soul. That's what immortal means,” Adam states emphatically.
They go on for a few more miles quietly pondering their thoughts in silence. Then Adam again starts to talk. “The spirit that goes back to God is his own spirit. We need God's spirit to live and breathe, it makes us alive. When we die and don't need it any more, it goes back to him. It's not the spirit of man going to God. The spirit shall return unto God who gave it, that's God's spirit going back to him. As well, this text is talking about the way it is for all of humanity. Are you comfortable saying that everyone, including the wicked, will go off to be with God at death?”
Fully alert and wide eyed Isaac sits unresponsive, silently going over memorized scriptures to use in the conversation and occasionally typing out a few Google searches for clarification. Eventually Isaac speaks. “So you are saying that mankind has no eternal soul, they just stay in their grave when they die. That idea goes against what the New Testament tells me.”
Adam speaks up quickly. “No. I’m not saying that. I am trying to faithfully read what the Bible tells me and not add things to it. Now before we move onto other verses. What is your conclusion for the verses we just covered in Genesis and Ecclesiastes? Do they tell us man has an immortal soul or spirit innately within us? Were we created immortal by God in Eden?”
Isaac shifts uncomfortably in his seat. “Well I guise they don't spell it out completely there, you have to look at the subject with other verses in mind. Take all of the verses as a whole, rather than each one on their own.”
Adam encapsulates his thoughts. “Well if there are no verses that say definitively that man has eternal life within himself, how can looking at a lot of verses that don't say we are immortal, lead us to believe we are? To me, that seems to be circumstantial at best and completely self-deluding. There are many verses that tell us we are flesh and blood. ‘And the Lord said. My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years’. Aren't verses like that telling us the truth?”
“Well take for example King David's infant son that died,” Isaac begins a rebuttal. “When the baby died he went to heaven because David said that the baby couldn't come back to him, but that he would be going to the baby. You need a soul or spirit to go to heaven.”
“Oh, I think you better look that one up and read it.” Adam advises.
Finding the passage Isaac reads it to Adam.
“2 Samuel 12:21-23
21 Then said his servants unto him, What thing is this that thou hast done? thou didst fast and weep for the child, while it was alive; but when the child was dead, thou didst rise and eat bread.
22 And he said, While the child was yet alive, I fasted and wept: for I said, Who can tell whether God will be gracious to me, that the child may live?
23 But now he is dead, wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me.
See? David will be joining his dead son in heaven. The baby couldn't come to David, but David would be going to him. Why are these ideas so hard for you to grasp? Don't you want to go to heaven when you die?”
“Again, the scripture does not tell us the baby went to heaven, only that the baby could not return to David and that David would be joining the baby where ever it was,” Adam says.
“Yes, that is right, David was going to join the baby,” Isaac agrees, expecting David to be in Heaven by now.
Adam volleys the ball back to Isaac in their verbal tennis match. “The Bible tells us David is asleep with his fathers. Paul also tells us in Acts that David has seen corruption and is still in his grave. If David was expecting to go to his grave and sleep which is also supported in the New Testament, then it only stands to reason that the baby was in its own grave as well. Yes, David would be going to his son when he died. They would be metaphorically sleeping together in their graves.”
Pulling some food out of a soft cooler bag on the floor by the stick shift, Adam makes his points as he chews on a granola bar. With his free hand Adam offers one of the foil wrapped delights to Isaac as he spoke. Isaac looks at it curiously then nods his thanks. Taking it, he unwraps the chocolate covered nut bar hungrily and devours it veraciously.
“That's better,” Adam says jokingly. “You’re just not yourself when you’re hungry.”
Isaac gets the joke, having seen the Snickers commercials.
“Oh! Marsha, Marsha, Marsha,” he replies grinning broadly.
“I'm not sure. This is not how we covered it in class,” Isaac states referring to their discussion.
“Well you have probably always been told what those verses mean, haven't you? When you were in college did you have a lot of free time to think about what you read in the bible?” Adam inquirers.
“No, I had a full course load like everyone else. With sports and the clubs after school we all had to cram in study to get it all done. There wasn’t a lot of free time. I took good study notes from the class lectures and would go over them for tests and essays. I got good marks. I know the Bible,” Isaac said defensively.
“I have little doubt that you were very diligent with your schooling Isaac. The teachers would have been happy with your test results because you gave them the answers they wanted. You memorized the material they covered very well. But did you scrutinize the validity of that material before you believed it? Did you have time to sit and ponder about what the bible said? A lot of people think that driving a truck is a boring no mind kind of a job, but this job gives me lots of time to think and ponder,” said Adam. “So, what new testament scriptures should we look at?” Adam asks.
“I got one ready,” Isaac says confidently. “2 Corinthians 5:8.” He starts to read but Adam interrupts.
“Let’s use the entire passage to get the context, rather than just one verse,” Adam suggests.
“OK I will also use the New King James for a change.” Isaac makes the changes on the lap top and begins to read.
“2 Corinthians 5:1-8
Assurance of the Resurrection
1 For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens. 2 For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed with our habitation which is from heaven, 3 if indeed, having been clothed, we shall not be found naked. 4 For we who are in this tent groan, being burdened, not because we want to be unclothed, but further clothed, that mortality may be swallowed up by life. 5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee. 6 So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. 7 For we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.
There you go, we will be pleased to be absent from our bodies and be present with the Lord when we die. We go to heaven to be with Jesus when we die. It is very plain and easy to understand,” Isaac contends.
Adam pauses for a moment, then slowly starts to talk. “In order for what you say to be true, mankind would already have to have an immortal soul, which we didn't find supported throughout the Old Testament. Otherwise when you die you would be dead. Also notice that we are given the Spirit as a guarantee that what God has promised will come true and this Spirit is not given to all of humanity. We don't receive the Spirit to give us immortality, but to give us guidance and comfort. The heading that started the passage was Assurance of the Resurrection. This passage is talking about the resurrection of the believers. Jesus told his disciples 4 times when this resurrection would take place in John 6.30-54”
“Wait. I want to look that up.” Isaac interrupts. “We did a class on John and I don't recall that.” Typing, Isaac finds the Chapter. Reading qu
ickly Isaac comes to the verses Adam referred to.
“John 6:30-54 KJV
30 They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work?
31 Our fathers did eat manna in the desert; as it is written, He gave them bread from heaven to eat.
32 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven.
33 For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world.
34 Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread.
35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst.
36 But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not.
37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.
38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.
39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.
40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
41 The Jews then murmured at him, because he said, I am the bread which came down from heaven.
42 And they said, Is not this Jesus, the son of Joseph, whose father and mother we know? how is it then that he saith, I came down from heaven?
43 Jesus therefore answered and said unto them, Murmur not among yourselves.
44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.
45 It is written in the prophets, And they shall be all taught of God. Every man therefore that hath heard, and hath learned of the Father, cometh unto me.
46 Not that any man hath seen the Father, save he which is of God, he hath seen the Father.
47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life.
48 I am that bread of life.
49 Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead.
50 This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die.
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
52 The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat?
53 Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.
54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.
“There, at the last day,” Adam draws attention to the text. “Verse 39, 40, 44 and 54, the last day is when Jesus returns to earth. ‘At the last day’ is when we will be, ‘well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord’. At the last day, is when we will receive our immortality. ‘So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord’. We are confident of our future resurrection for we walk by faith, not by sight. We have the Holy Spirit until then as our guide and guarantee of Gods promise to us,” continuing, Adam presses his point.
“Besides, 2 Corinthians doesn't state that we have a soul that lives on after we die. You have to believe we have an immortal soul ahead of time to understand those verses like you say. It's not cut and dry like in Acts when it says. ‘There is salvation in no one else! Under all heaven there is no other name for men to call upon to save them’. If there was a verse forthright like that saying we had an immortal soul, it would be simpler to prove we all have eternal life innately within us. But there isn't and we don't.”
Isaac's thoughts are whirling inside his head. “Oh. I don't know.” He says cautiously slow. “I need to think about this for a bit.”
“Take your time,” Adam says. “Would you like to stop for a while and stretch your legs? We will be in Merit soon; we can get something to drink.”
“That sounds good to me,” Isaac replies, and stares out the window. He starts typing again and soon asks. “What about in
Philippians 1:20-24. Paul says that to die is gain.
20 According to my earnest expectation and my hope, that in nothing I shall be ashamed, but that with all boldness, as always, so now also Christ shall be magnified in my body, whether it be by life, or by death.
21 For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain.
22 But if I live in the flesh, this is the fruit of my labour: yet what I shall choose I wot not.
23 For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:
24 Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you.
He looks forward to death so he can be with Jesus. So he will be with Jesus at his death.”
Adam formulates his response as he passes a camper driving in the slow lane. Checking his mirrors to see that it is safe, he pulls back into the right hand lane in front of the vacationers, their image growing steadily smaller as the distance increases between them. “I like the KJV version but sometimes it can be hard to understand what is being said. Try an easier to read version, just for clarity.”
“OK. I can do that. How about this?
‘Easy-to-Read Version’.
20 I am full of hope and feel sure I will not have any reason to be ashamed. I am certain I will continue to have the same boldness to speak freely that I always have. I will let God use my life to bring more honor to Christ. It doesn’t matter whether I live or die. 21 To me, the only important thing about living is Christ. And even death would be for my benefit. 22 If I continue living here on earth, I will be able to work for the Lord. But what would I choose—to live or to die? I don’t know. 23 It would be a hard choice. Sometimes I want to leave this life and be with Christ. That would be much better for me; 24 however, you people need me here alive.
See, Paul says that it would be better for him if he was to die and be with Christ. When he dies he believes he will be with Jesus, that part is straight forward.” Isaac explains.
“Well if we remember Paul's life, he was always getting beat-up by unbelievers and the Jews. His life as a disciple was a hard one. So like he said, ‘But what would I choose—to live or to die’? I don’t know. It would be a hard choice. He knows that people need him to help them with their faith, yet he says. ‘Sometimes I want to leave this life and be with Christ’.
It doesn't say, when, he would be with Christ. It only shows that he had faith that he would be with Jesus. John 6 tells us Paul will be with Jesus, at the last day, when Jesus returns. He explains this hope of the resurrection in 1 Thessalonians when he talks about the brethren that are asleep. Can you find it?” Adam asks, glancing over to his right at Isaac.
“Ya. I think so,” responds Isaac. “Yes here it is.
1 Thessalonians 4:13-17
But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope.
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
See they return with Jesus, so they must be in heaven with him now,” Isaac points out excitedly.
Adam quickly responds dramatically. “Just keep reading and you’ll see.”
Isaac continues.
“15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with
the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:”
“There did you get it? At the descent of the Lord is when the dead in Christ rise first. Just like we read in John, at my return, that's when everyone which seethe the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life,” Adam interrupts abruptly.
Isaac continues with the last verse.
“17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”
“Do you see it now? It all starts with a resurrection at the return of Jesus. That is when we get our new life. Until Jesus returns, those believers who die, are asleep in their graves. Paul thinks, I want to leave this life and be with Christ. That would be much better for him. He would escape a lot of violent persecution if he was dead. He would be in peaceful sleep, knowing nothing of the world or its cares. His next conscious thought would be when he rises with his new body at the return of Jesus. After he dies, he will be with Jesus, just as he knew he would be. It doesn't happen though until the resurrection, on the day of the Lord, along with all of the other believers that have died. There is another verse that is similar at the end of Hebrews 11. See if you can find it.”
Isaac is familiar with what is commonly called the faith chapter. He is curious about the verse Adam was referring to, as he didn't remember any verse there that talked about a resurrection from the dead. He finds the chapter and starts to scan through it.
“How far down is your verse Adam?” He questions.
“Right at the end, the last 3 or 4 verses,” Adam assures him.
“OK. I will read the last 6 verses for context.
Hebrews 11:35-40
35 Women received their dead raised to life again: and others were tortured, not accepting deliverance; that they might obtain a better resurrection:
36 And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment:
37 They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented;
38 (Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.
39 And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:
40 God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.”
Isaac finishes reading the chapter.
“There, the last 2 verses. They received not the promise, the promise of eternal life. None of them received it. Why not? They’re all dead. Why weren’t they changed and taken off to heaven? The next verse tells us why.
They didn't receive it, the promise of eternal life, because God had something better for, all of us, ‘so that they, without us, should not be made perfect’. We are all made perfect at the same time. We all will receive eternal life together at the same time, at the return of Jesus, at the last day. That is when we are changed and made perfect. That is when we are to be resurrected from the dead and receive our new bodies. Remember, according to the Old Testament, we don’t have an immortal soul.”
“You know I have read that chapter since I was little and I’ve never thought of it that way before, you make some interesting points for sure,” Isaac admits.
“Well it's not me,” Adam says modestly. “It's the Bible scriptures speaking, would you expect anything less than for them to be consistent? It is the word of God, he will not lie, nor will he contradict himself. If the Bible appears to be contradictory then it is us who don't understand the text properly. I think there is another passage that tells us about the resurrection of the believers in their order. Can you look it up?” Adam questions Isaac.
“I'll give it a try. Not much to go on, but we'll see what comes up.” Isaac starts doing a search on the net. “Here it is. That was easy, got it on the first try. There is a lot of semi related verses, I will read it all just for context”
1 Corinthians 15:12-26
Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
13 But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:
14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished.
19 If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable.
20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.
“Here, I'll read it from the Good News Translation,” offed Isaac.
1 Corinthians 15:12-26 Our Resurrection
Now, since our message is that Christ has been raised from death, how can some of you say that the dead will not be raised to life? 13 If that is true, it means that Christ was not raised; 14 and if Christ has not been raised from death, then we have nothing to preach and you have nothing to believe. 15 More than that, we are shown to be lying about God, because we said that he raised Christ from death—but if it is true that the dead are not raised to life, then he did not raise Christ. 16 For if the dead are not raised, neither has Christ been raised. 17 And if Christ has not been raised, then your faith is a delusion and you are still lost in your sins. 18 It would also mean that the believers in Christ who have died are lost. 19 If our hope in Christ is good for this life only and no more, then we deserve more pity than anyone else in all the world.
20 But the truth is that Christ has been raised from death, as the guarantee that those who sleep in death will also be raised. 21 For just as death came by means of a man, in the same way the rising from death comes by means of a man. 22 For just as all people die because of their union with Adam, in the same way all will be raised to life because of their union with Christ. 23 But each one will be raised in proper order: Christ, first of all; then, at the time of his coming, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come; Christ will overcome all spiritual rulers, authorities, and powers, and will hand over the Kingdom to God the Father. 25 For Christ must rule until God defeats all enemies and puts them under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be defeated will be death.
Adam affirms the scripture choice with an excited, “Ya! That was it! Verse 23 is where it tells us people will be raised in proper order. Jesus is first, then the believers when he returns. Believers don't go to heaven when they die. They sleep in their graves until Jesus comes back to get them. That's when we all receive our promised eternal life, together, at his return.”
Chapter 5
But Others Say
The Eden Conspiracy Page 4
