Li Jing said: “What Zhang Liang studied was Jiang Ziya’s ‘Six Secret Teachings’ and ‘The Three Strategies’. What Han Xin studied were the books of Sima Rangju and Sun Tzu. But the main principles do not go beyond the ‘Three Focus’ and ‘Four Schools’; that is all.”
Tang Taizong asked: “What is meant by the ‘Three Focus’?”
Li Jing said: “I find that in the eighty one chapters of the ‘Plans of Jiang Ziya’, military strategies cannot be exhausted; the seventy chapters of the ‘Sayings of Jiang Ziya’, troops cannot be exhausted; and the eighty five chapters of the ‘Warfare of Jiang Ziya’, resources cannot be exhausted. These are the ‘Three Focus’.”
Tang Taizong asked: “What is meant by the ‘Four Schools’?”
Li Jing said: “These are what Ren Hong from Han has discussed: four classes of military strategists, ‘strategies and tactics’, ‘circumstances and developments’, ‘yin and yang’ and ‘techniques and crafts’.”
太宗问：有人说《司马法》是穰苴所著，是不是？
李靖答：根据《史记• 穰苴列传》记载，齐景公时，穰苴善于用兵，曾击败燕国和各国的军队，景公加封他为司马，于是人皆称为司马穰苴。他的子孙、也号称司马氏。到齐威王时，命大 臣追论、整理古《司马法》，并将穰苴的兵法附记子内，遂有司马穰苴兵书数十篇。现在所有的兵家流派分为权谋、形势、阴阳、技巧四种，都出自《司马法》。
太宗问：汉张良、韩信将古兵法排列为一百八十二家，经过甄别删去芜伪，择其精要可用的选定了三十五家，现在为什么失传了呢？
李靖答：〔没有完全失传，〕张良所学的就是太公的《六韬》《三略》，韩信所学的就是穰苴、孙武的兵法，然而这些兵书的内容，大体不外三门四种。
太宗问：什么叫三门？
李靖答：太公谈政治外交的”阴谋”有八十一篇，所谓阴谋的意义，不是”言”篇所陈的善言能够说明的；太公谈品德修养的”言”有七十一篇，其中的意义不是”兵”篇所讲的兵法能够说明的；太公谈军事原理的”兵”有八十五篇，其中的意义不是所讲的富国之道能够说明的。这就是三门。
太宗问：什么是四种？
李靖答：汉成帝时任宏所论述的就是这个问题，他把兵家流派区分为权谋、形势、阴阳、技巧四种。
Question 12
Tang Taizong said: “The ‘Sima Fa’ begins by mentioning the Spring and Winter ceremonial hunts. Why?”
Li Jing answered: “To accord with the seasons and the ritual of paying respect to the spirits, then put in the schedule for training; this is to pay attention to priorities. Thus agriculture and rituals that pay respect to spirits are the most important government affairs, according to the Zhou Rites. King Cheng held the Spring Hunt on the southern side of Mount Qi. King Kang held the assembly at Feng Palace. King Mu held the assembly at Mount Tu. These are affairs of the Son of Heaven.
“When the Zhou rule declined, Duke Huan of Qi assembled the armies of the feudal state at Zhao Ling, while Duke Wen of Jin made his alliance with the feudal Lords at Jian Tu. In these cases, the feudal Lords respectfully performed the affairs of the Son of Heaven. In actuality, they used the Law of Nine Attacks to overawe the irreverent. They employed the pretext of the hunt to hold court assemblies, accordingly conducting tours and hunts among the feudal Lords, as well as conducting military exercises. The ‘Sima Fa’ states that unless there is a national emergency, the army should not be wantonly mobilized, but that during the times between the agricultural seasons, they should certainly not forget military preparations. Thus it is not profound that it placed the hunts of Spring and Winter at the beginning chapters!”
太宗问：《司马法》首先便叙述春天和冬天狩猎的事，是什么缘故？
李靖答：利用农闲季节[进 行田猎以教练战法]，并祭祀宗庙托之于神，这是为了郑重其事，所以《周礼》 [将田猎]列为最重要的制度。周成王时曾在歧山的南面进行过田猎，周康王曾借田猎在酆宫受过诸侯的朝见，周穆王亦在涂山田猎会合过诸侯，这都是天子亲自主持的事。周室衰微以后，齐桓公曾与诸侯会师于召陵，晋文公曾与诸侯结盟于践土，这都是诸侯假天子之命所行之事。其实都是用”九伐之法”来威慑不遵王命的诸侯。假借朝会的名义，利用巡狩的机会，进行军事训练，是说国家无事不要轻易动兵，必须利用农闲季节[举行田猎]，这就是不忘备战的意思。所以《司马法》首先叙述田猎，不是有很深远的意义吗！
Question 13
Tang Taizong said: “During the Spring and Autumn period, the ‘Methods for the Double Battalion of King Zhuang of Chu’ stated that ‘the hundred officers should act in accord with the symbolization of things, military administration should be prepared without official instructions.’ Did this accord with the Zhou regulations?”[24]
Li Jing said: ‘According to the Zhuo Zhuan, ‘King Zhuang’s chariot battalions consisted of thirty chariots per battalion. Each chariot in the battalion had a company of infantrymen plus a platoon for the flanks.’ When the army was advancing, the battalion on the right was deployed by flanks. They took their flank as their defining measure. Thus they stayed close to the flanks to fight. These were all Zhou regulations.”
“In the case of Chu, I refer to 100 men as a company, while fifty men are called a platoon. Thus each chariot is accompanied by 150 men, many more than in the Zhou organization. Under the Zhou, each chariot was accompanied by seventy two infantry men and three armored officers. Twenty five men, including an officer, formed one platoon, so three Zhou platoons were seventy five men altogether. Qi is a country of mountains and marshes; chariots were few, men numerous. If they were to be divided into three platoons, then they would be functionally the same as the Zhou.”
太宗问：按春秋《左传》所载，楚庄王的军队有二广的编制，其规定说：”军中百官根据旗鼓的号令而行动，军队的事情不待命令就有所准备。”这也是来自周朝的制度吗？
李靖答：根据《左传》上说：”楚庄王的亲兵广(车队)三十辆，每辆车士卒人数为一卒(一百人)比周制每车人数多一倍。步卒在车的右边行动，以车的右辕为准，在两车之间进行战斗。”这都是周朝的制度。我认为：按百人为一卒，五十人为一两，这样，楚国的战车，每求是用士卒一百五十人，比周制人数加多了。周制一乘车只有步卒七十二人，甲士三 人；以二十五人为一甲，三甲共七十五人。楚国多高山大泽，车少人多，也[将一百五十人]区分为三队，这种三队区分法与周朝的制度是一样的。
Question 14
Tang Taizong said: “During the Spring and Autumn period, when Sun Tzu attacked the Di, he abandoned his chariots and used infantry units instead. Were they also indirect troops? Or direct troops?”[25]
Li Jing said: “Sun Tzu used strategy for chariot warfare; that is all. Although he abandoned the chariots, his strategy is still found therein. One force acted as the left flank, one force acted as the right flank, and one resisted the enemy in the front. Dividing them into three units, this is one tactic for chariot warfare. Whether 1,000 or 10,000 chariots; it would be the same. I observe that in Duke Cao’s ‘Xin Shu’ it states: ‘Attack chariots are accompanied by seventy five men. To the fore, to oppose the enemy is one unit; to the left and right corners are two more units. The defense chariots have an additional unit. It consists of ten men to prepare the food, five to repair and maintain the equipment, five to care for the horses and five to gather firewood and fetch water – altogether twenty five men. For a pair of attack and defense chariots, altogether there are 100 men.’ If you mobilize 100,000 men, you would employ 1,000 each of the light attack and heavy defense chariots. This is the general outline of Sun Tzu’s old methods.”
“Moreover, I observe that in the period from Han
to Wei, army regulations had five chariots comprise a platoon, with a supervisor to command them. Ten chariots formed a regiment, under a chief commandant. For 1,000 chariots, there were two men, a general and lieutenant general. If more chariots, the organization followed this pattern. If I examine it in comparison with our present methods, then our probing force is the old cavalry; our frontal assault troops are the old infantry and cavalry, half and half; and our holding force goes forth with combined chariot tactics.”
“When I went to the west to correct and punish the Tu Jue, we crossed several thousand miles of treacherous terrain, I never dared change this system for the constraints and regulations of the ancients can truly be trusted.”
太宗问：春秋时，晋国的荀吴领兵伐狄于大卤地方，舍弃车战，改为步战，这是正兵，还是奇兵呢？
李靖答：荀吴是用车战的方法。他虽然舍弃车战改用步战，但仍然是用车战的方法。[在进战时]以一队为左角，一队为右角，一队为前拒，共分三队，这是一乘车的作战方法，就是千乘万乘都是一样的。 我 按《曹公新书》说：攻车一乘有七十五人，分为前拒一队，左右角各一队；守车一队，包括有炊事人员十人，守护装具的五人，饲养马匹的五人，砍柴担水的五人， 共计二十五人，攻守两车共有士卒百人。所以动员十万军队，就需要战车千乘，也就是需要轻、重车二千乘，这是荀吴旧法的大概情况。再从汉魏的军制来看，通常 以五车为一队，设仆射一人；十车为师，设率长一人；兵车千乘设正副将领二人，如兵车再增多也是仿效这样的办法。我现在的方法是参照古来使用的，跳荡队，由 骑兵组成，战锋队，由步骑各半的混合部成，驻队则由步兵和车辆组成。我西讨突厌时，越过险阻转战数里，这种制度也未敢轻易变动。因为古时的战法严整不乱，确实应当重视。
Question 15
Tang Taizong said: “Zhuge Liang once stated that: ‘A well-trained army cannot be defeated by its enemies, even when the general is incapable in commanding. However, when the army is lacking in training, no matter how talented the general is, the army would still be unable to conquer its enemies.’ However, I doubt that this conclusion may not necessarily be the absolute certainty under such circumstances.”
Li Jing answered: “Zhuge Liang made this statement out of personal feelings. According to Sun Tzu’s ‘Art of War’, ‘When the general is weak and lacking of authority, when his orders are unclear and not distinct, when the duties and not fixed and assigned to men and officers respectively, and the ranks are formed in a slovenly haphazard manner, the result is utter disorganization.’ Since ancient times, an enemy’s victory is caused by our own disarray, and chaos has occurred numerous times in the history. The so-called ‘When the general is weak and lacking of authority, when his orders are unclear and distinct’ refers to the military training not following the traditional method; What we called ‘there are no fixed duties assigned to men and officers’ refers to a frequent change in duties of soldiers. What we called ‘Our own chaos cited our enemies victory’ refers to the fact that when our army is in disarray and unorganized, our losses are caused by our chaos, and not by our enemies. Therefore, Zhuge Liang stated that ‘A well-trained army cannot be defeated by its enemies, even when the general is incapable in commanding. However when the army has fallen into their own chaos and disorganization, no matter how talented the general is, he still could not save the army from peril.’ There is no doubt about this statement.”
Tang Taizong said: “The importance of methods used for military training and inspecting must not be ignored.”
Li Jing answered: “When the training method truly works, the soldiers will happily serve us and follow the commands given; however, when our training method fails, even though we inspect them day and night, it would not serve any purpose. The reason why I need to focus and study the traditional training system, and compile them into drawings is to educate our soldiers to become a highly organized and well-trained army.”
Tang Taizong said: “I need you to choose for me an ancient battle formation, illustrate all of your choices and send them to me.”
太宗曰：诸葛亮说：”训练有素的军队，即使将帅没有才能，也不会被敌人打败，没有训练的军队，即使将帅有才能，也不会战胜敌人。”我怀疑这种说法，不一定是很正确的论断。
李靖答：武侯[这种说法]是有所感而发的。按《孙子》说：”教道不明，吏卒无常，陈兵纵横，曰乱。” 自古以来，由于自己混久而造成敌人胜利的不可胜数。所谓”教 道不明”，是指军队教育没有遵照古法；所谓”吏卒无常”，是指将吏士卒时任用经常变动，所谓”乱军引胜”，是指敌人取得的胜利是由于我们自己的混乱所造成 的，而不是敌人打胜的。所以武侯说：”军队训练有素，虽然将帅没有才能，也不会被敌人打败；如果军队自己溃乱，即使将帅有才能，也不能挽救于危亡。”这有 什么可疑的呢！
太宗说：教育和校阅的方法，实在不能忽视。
李靖答：教育得法，士卒就乐于为我所用；教育不得法，纵然早晚督促责备也无济于事。我所以要专心研究古制并把它编纂成图，是希望教育官兵使之成为有训练的军队。
太宗说：你为我选择古代阵法，全部绘制成图送上来。
Question 16
Tang Taizong asked: “When an army from another kingdom is warring, they choose to use running, powerful and strong horses to create a huge impact. Is this considered indirect tactics in military strategy? Han’s army uses strong bows with coordination, is this considered as direct tactics in military strategy?”
Li Jing answered: “According to Sun Tzu’s ‘Art of War’: ‘A clever combatant looks to the effect of combined energy and does not require too much energy from each individual; hence, he is highly capable of utilizing the combined strengths in individuals who would be suitable under different circumstances.’ The so-called ‘choosing individuals who possess different strengths’ refers to adapting the strengths of a foreign army and Han’s army to carry out the combat. The foreign army is good at riding skills, therefore is more suitable for speedy battle; Han’s army is adept in using bow and arrow, therefore is beneficial to launch slow-paced wars. We are naturally adapting with different situations, while utilizing our own strengths; but this is not the difference between direct tactics and indirect tactics. I said before that a foreign army or Han’s army change their flags and costumes to fool their enemy, this is the true form of applying indirect strategies. In horse wars, direct and indirect strategies are used simultaneously, as is so in a war of bows; therefore things will constantly change and nothing will remain the same!”
Tang Taizong said: “Please explain further the method used.”
Li Jing replied: “First, we have to make a false impression to lure the enemy, causing the enemy to obey my commands. This is the approach used.”
Tang Taizong said: “I can understand this kind of spirit now. Sun Tzu’s ‘Art of War’ stated that: ‘In making tactical dispositions, the highest point you could attain is concealing them’ and ‘How victory may be produced for them out of the enemy’s own tactics—that is what the multitude cannot comprehend.’ Are these the same idea of indirect tactics?”
Li Jing bowed again and said: “What Sun Tzu stated is very obscure! But my wise majesty has understood more than half of it.”
太宗问：番兵作战常用劲马奔驰冲击，这是奇兵吗？汉兵作战常用强弩互相配合，这是正兵吗？
李靖答：按《孙子》说：”善 于用兵的人，要从所造成的有利形势上去手求取胜之道，不可责于人，要能选择具有不同长处的人，去适应不同的形势。”所谓选择不同长处的人，也就是利用番汉 兵卒的特长而进行战斗。番兵善于乘马，所以利于速战；汉兵长于用努，所以利于缓战，这就自然地适应了不同的�
�势，然而这并不是奇兵和正兵的区别。我以前曾 讲过番汉变更旗号，更换服装，这才是奇兵和正兵相互为用的方法。马战有奇也有正，努战有正也有奇，哪有固定不变的呢！
太宗说：你再详细地解说一下这种方法。
李靖答：先做出假象引诱敌人，使敌人听从我的调动，就是这种方法。
太宗说：我领悟这种精神了。《孙予》说：”欺骗敌人的行动巧妙到了极点，就会看不出形迹来。”又说：”运用各种欺骗敌人的方法以取得胜利，但许多人还不知道胜利是怎样得来的。”就是这样的道理吗？
李靖再拜说：孙子所说的很深奥啊！陛下英明，已领会过半了。
Question 17
Tang Taizong said: “Recently, the two tribes Khitan and Xi have come to pledge allegiance. I have named captaincy for these two places, Song Mo and Rao Le and they are supposed to follow the orders of the Protectorate General of the North. I am thinking about assigning Xue Wan Che for the position, and I would like to hear your opinion on this.”
Li Jing answered: “Xue Wan Che is not as talented as Ashina She’er, Zhi Shi Si Li and Qi Bi He Li; among all of our foreign minister these three understand military strategies the most. I know about their talents because I have discussed with them the topography around Song Mo and Rao Le, the road conditions and the loyalty of the tribes. Their opinions are clear and trustworthy even when we are talking about the dozens of tribes in the West.
“When I teach them about battle formations, they all nodded with admiration. I hope my majesty could assign the task to them without hesitation. Xue Wan Che is just foolhardy; he can’t carry such heavy responsibilities alone.”
Military Strategy Classics of Ancient China Page 50
